Dennis Oz: Welcome to the Remodeler Success Podcast, where we speak all about kitchen and bathroom remodeling. And you know, folks, that I’m always hosting a really valuable speaker on this podcast. This time, I’m so excited because I’m bringing you one of the top-notch design and build business owners who has years of experience in the field.

I don’t want to steal his thunder, but I will introduce him in a minute. Before that, I just want to talk about why this content is really important for you guys. We’re getting a lot of emails from you saying that you’re listening and tuning in while going from point A to B, and you all want to improve your business and take it to the next level.

That’s why our goal is to bring you something that you can always get value from, and something you can include in your own operations, or maybe your marketing, or even your human resources when you’re hiring. This is why this information is really important. We understand that, and we want to bring you the best from the industry.

So, without further ado, I have Dylan Martin here, the owner of Absolute Design Build. Dylan, welcome to the show.

Dylan Martin: Hi. Thank you for having me.

Dennis Oz: Alright Dylan, could you please introduce yourself, just a little bit?

Dylan Martin: Sure. Well, my name’s Dylan Martin. I am one of the two owners of Absolute Design Build. That’s our primary company. We also have Alpha Team Roofing and Exteriors, and Blue Basin Pools. So we kind of run the gamut on three different companies that coincide.

We are located in Leander, Texas, which is just north of Austin. I have been in this industry for about 25 years now. It’s been a rough road, I’ve learned a lot, and we are super excited about where we’re headed right now. Any chance I have to help somebody out and share some knowledge, I’m always willing to do so.

Dennis Oz: Great. Well, thanks so much for joining the show.

Dylan, breaking a million in revenue is a big hassle for most of our listeners here. I just want to ask you, how do you think you were able to break a million in revenue in your first year? What do you attribute that kind of early success to?

Dylan Martin: To be frank, I had a little bit of an easier time because Absolute Design Build is not my first company in construction. So I had years of hard knocks, lessons learned, and quitting the industry only to come back to it. I took those lessons learned, found the right group of people to put around me, and said, “Okay, here’s what didn’t work, here’s what did work. Let’s build this from the ground up and make it successful with the right foundation.”

With that, we were able to put a lot of practices in place, shook a lot of hands, and really got going. So yes, we started in—let’s see—that was March of 2021, and we did $1.2 million in those nine months. That’s not to say that it was a walk in the park—we had to do the hard work to get there. But with the lessons learned, I think anybody could do it.

Dennis Oz: Great. Thanks so much. I’ll just go back to those early stages a little bit. I have a couple more questions about that. Since you built this with your partners, and you are one of the biggest parts of building this Absolute Design Build company from the ground up, I’d like to learn about some of the key strategies you used in the early stages.

Maybe they’re different from what you’re doing now, but I want to focus on the beginning because you’re talking to the luxury market. What were the key strategies? Can you talk about that a little bit?

Dylan Martin: So, a lot of people—well, I was that person the first time—I jumped into remodeling because I didn’t know what else to do. I needed to eat and make money, and I was good at building things. Basically, I come from a lineage of builders, so it was natural to fall back into it after my time in the military.

And I messed it up really bad as a business owner and learned a lot.

So, point being, fast forward to starting over again with Absolute Design Build—I had to go through the basic questions that everybody usually wants to speed through:

• What is your why?

• Why are you doing this?

• What is your purpose?

• What value are you trying to bring to people?

• Are you doing this for the right reasons?

• Do you know what your goals are?

All of these fundamentals that everybody blows through are so important, because if you don’t build that out, then you’re just kind of—well, you know, if you’re not aiming at anything, you’re going to hit at a hundred percent rate.

Dylan Martin: So you’ve got to figure out what your target is, and you’ve got to figure out what your value is. I’ve worked with people who don’t go into this industry to serve—they go into it to make money. And that is completely the wrong attitude. You can make money doing anything, but that doesn’t mean you’re going to build the following and the culture you want.

So we spent a lot of time—we brought our families together, our wives together with my business partner—and we sat around the table and discussed this thoroughly. Then we brought in outside people that we know, like, and trust. They knew nothing about the industry, but we asked them, “Hey, how does this sound to you?”

We formed our why, our purpose, our reason, and what we could bring. Then we took a really hard look at lessons learned in the past and asked, “How do we build a company for success? What do we need to do to create a solid foundation?” Because we could have all the right intent in the world and want to do good for people, but if we don’t have a solid business plan, it’s still going to collapse.

You’re managing money—you’re basically a steward of somebody else’s money. And if you don’t treat that money like it’s someone else’s and you’re responsible for it, then bad things are going to happen and you’re going to fail.

So we looked at the lessons learned and said, “Okay, what do we need to do here?” Not only what do we need to do, but who do we need to do it? And how do we vet that person to make sure they’re actually doing it? Because those were some of the hard lessons we learned in the past.

We spent a lot of time looking for a bookkeeper. A lot. We ended up going with a bookkeeping firm that specializes in construction because, well, we’re in construction. I wanted someone who knows my industry inside and out. They’re a firm, meaning they have multiple people. It’s not someone saying, “Oh, I can do your books after hours and on weekends, and I’ll charge you very little.” That is a mistake. I’ve been down that road multiple times.

So we found a very legitimate firm, interviewed them multiple times, and it wasn’t cheap—but so far, that’s been one of the best decisions I’ve made. They’re actually called My Staff Your Staff, and they’re out of Pflugerville, Texas. Fran and Lorena and the rest of their team have been absolutely amazing—worth every penny.

To complement that, you need a good CPA. This is the un-fun part of running a business. Your CPA should be able to advise you on taxes and write-offs, and they should work with your bookkeepers so everyone is on the same page. It has to work in tandem, as a team.

So the point is, we had to decide the best way to manage other people’s money so we didn’t get ourselves into trouble. And that was step number one.

Once we did that, we had to decide how we wanted to manage someone’s projects. And this is all before we started talking about sales and all the fun stuff. This was: how do we manage someone’s project?

We went through the very basic steps of putting a large whiteboard on the wall—it’s still right here—and we mapped out our flowcharts. We mapped out how the process is going to go, who’s running it, and how the flow of materials will happen. We documented our processes.

It sounds straightforward, and everyone rushes through it, but if you do an actual flowchart, you’ll find little hiccups you need to iron out. We found a few. I had already been in the field for 20 years, and my partner at that time had been in for 15. So it’s really easy to say, “Oh, we know how to do that, no problem.”

Well, we found problems—especially with two different people working together—and we did our best to create a plan to fix those problems. That plan has been refined and refined and refined over the last four years.

Once we did that, we documented the processes and figured out what our scalability needed to be. At what point would we need a project manager? At what point would we need this or that? So we started to define our milestones—our data points.

Now we know how to manage clients’ money. We know how we’re going to run a project.

Oh, and there’s one more aspect to running a project that I want to mention—you have to have good project management software. You’ve got to have something.

What do I use right now, if you want to ask? I use JobTread. Huge fan. They’re based out of Dallas.

Dylan Martin: I’ve used the whole gamut of stuff. I was in the beta testing phase with Buildertrend when they first started. That probably dates me a bit because they’ve been out for a while. Not a bad company—I can’t knock them. But when they started to scale up, their software got kind of clunky.

Then we switched to CoConstruct, which was really great. And then they got bought out by Buildertrend, and their service went down. So we finally had to make a move. We tried a couple of other platforms—I don’t even remember the names—and then we found JobTread.

JobTread ties into our QuickBooks, which ties directly into our accounting, which ties into Bill.com. Oh, and it also ties into the CRM we use now—GoHighLevel—which I’m a big fan of. So it’s all relatively seamless. Yes, there’s a big learning curve, but now we know how to manage the sales coming in, the process of the projects, the management of the projects, and keeping our clients informed every step of the way.

So yeah—back to it—we now know how to run the job. Those were the two biggest things. And that ties into managing the client’s money. Money comes in, it flows through the accountants, flows through the project management software, and then into completing a good project.

Dennis Oz: I have more questions, especially about the sales process, because we also sometimes have long sales cycles. How do you structure your sales? I know it’s a process—can you just give us a little more information about the journey from the first meeting to the signed contract?

Dylan Martin: Yeah. So I’ve developed our sales process over a lifetime. And I’m going to tell you, the first thing you’ve got to do—before you even consider your sales process—is you’ve got to go back to the basics: your “why” and what your niche is.

Everybody’s like, “Oh, I’ll do anything—I need money.” But the reality is, people can smell that. And a lot of times, when you come across like that, they don’t hire you because they’re thinking, “Is this guy really good at this, or is he just trying to sell me because he needs the work?”

So you’ve got to focus.

Our focus really is higher-end renovations, larger scale. For us, a master bathroom remodel or a kitchen remodel is a very small project. I remember when I first started out and thought, “Oh my God, a kitchen—this is going to be scary!” Now it’s just a kitchen—no big deal.

So let’s say you’ve got your niche figured out. Our biggest seller is whole-house renovations, with or without an addition. Our average low-end ticket price is $250,000. Our high-end average has been about $750,000, and we’re running about a $400,000 to $500,000 median.

Dylan Martin: You know, I always want to up that number—because if you want to do $10 million a year, just sell ten $1 million jobs. Easy math. So we’re actually striving for that, and then we’ll bump it to $20 million.

Starting at the beginning—whether a phone call, an email, a text, or a Facebook message comes in—the first thing I do is respond back as fast as possible. I try to get them on the phone, because if somebody doesn’t want to talk to me on the phone, then they’re not going to be worth my time. Absolutely not worth my time.

If I can get them on the phone, then I can gather the information I need. What’s your full name? What’s your address? What’s your email? What’s your phone number—if they didn’t give it or gave the wrong one. A bunch of weird stuff can happen. But then I can learn about their project.

At that point, I start asking questions like:

-What is your timeframe for this?

-Are you just starting?

-Is this an emergency?

-Are you looking for something higher-end, luxury?

-Is this your rental property?

That helps me gauge whether they fit my niche. Then I can ask more probing questions to figure out whether they’re aligned with what we offer.

We’re not cheap—but we’re not the most expensive either. Some of our competitors charge a lot more. Others charge way less. We’re what I like to call a supported firm: we have project managers, an office manager, and systems in place. We’re still a smaller firm, doing just under $5 million a year. But we aspire to reach that $20 million mark, like some of the larger firms out there with more staff and premium pricing.

Once I’ve qualified them on the phone and feel it’s worth looking at, I’ll schedule an appointment. And this is where I think I start to really answer your question.

When I show up to the appointment, I listen. I listen, I listen, I listen. If I hear something they’re passionate about—what they like, what they don’t like—I just absorb it. If I have a good idea, I might share it. If I hear something totally off-base or unreasonable, I’ll say something. But my goal is to make sure they see me as intelligent and as an expert.

Because I know they’re probably going to be talking to competitors, I want to raise the bar so high that I leave a minefield for the next guy to trip over. I want to give solid information—factual, helpful, and inspiring to the client.

If there’s a question I can’t answer on the spot, I’ll say, “That’s a great question. Let me research that and get you a clear answer.” That’s how you build trust.

Also, you don’t want to do all the talking—you want to listen. You get to do your talking after they’re done. It might take them 20 minutes to wear out, it might take them an hour. But if they haven’t finished talking, you’re not going to get your message across. So let them talk, let them get tired a little bit. It’s like fishing—they’ve got to wear out before you reel them in.

Once we’re done, I leave behind a sales folder. I’ve got one sitting right here. It’s a nice one.

Inside, on one side, I’ve got all the cool stuff—awards we’ve won, past projects, testimonials. I usually skip going through it, and just tell them, “This is for you.” It’s a loss leader—people say, “Oh my God, that folder’s like seven bucks!” But that’s the cost of doing business.

Because usually you can’t get both the husband and wife together at the same time. And even if you do, they’re probably interviewing other people and won’t remember everything you said. So let the folder do the talking after you’re gone. Burn it if you have to—but it’s got to look good. Don’t print it on plain paper—have it professionally printed. That’s just the cost of making business.

Dennis Oz: That’s important. Folks, you all hear this, right? Some things you need to sacrifice. Yeah, that’s it. Yeah.

Dylan Martin: But on this side—I’ve got, I’m on the little screen—I’ve integrated transparency…

Dennis Oz: …and results. We can see that. Yes.

Dylan Martin: Yeah. So then I’ve got what our actual sales cycle is. I’ve got a lot of documents in here that I walk them through. I actually walk them through what our sales cycle looks like.

And in this case, I’ll read it to you:

We’re here at our discovery meeting. It typically takes one to three hours. The goal is to take lots of notes, photos, and find out what you like and dislike. While I’m there, I schedule a follow-up meeting within a week to go over our ballpark estimate.

I do not give estimates in the field. I take all my notes and pictures back to my estimator. We sit down and talk it through, so I can bring back a strong, informed ballpark estimate.

Our ballpark estimate includes a high range and a low range—because at this stage, we don’t have nearly enough information to give a detailed bid. So I’m throwing that dart, and based on my experience and ongoing projects, I’ll say, “I think your project will fall between here and here.”

That’s written up in a long-form sheet that we bring back. But I always show up to present it—because if I just email it, it never goes well. They look at it, get confused, see a big number, and start wondering, “Does this include this? Does it include that?” So you show up and go through it.

As a matter of fact, it looks like this:

The top section is what I think it will cost in design fees and services to design the project—so we’re all on the same page. Yes, we charge for that.

The second part is what we estimate for job-related costs—just to run the project.

The third part is all the labor, materials, and subcontractors required to actually build the project.

We run pretty transparently—everyone’s got the internet these days, everyone’s getting bids. So I just tell them what our markup is. If I get 30% off on tile, they get 30% off on tile—but I’m still putting my markup on it. That way, it’s a very straightforward and easy conversation.

I walk them through this—it takes about 15 minutes—and then I take them to the next step, which is the design contract:

I show them how much that will be.

I provide a sample of what the contract looks like.

We walk through what our design will look like.

I show them the kinds of documents they’ll receive.

And I treat the design as separate from the build. These are two different contracts.

Now, a lot of people say, “Well, if you rolled it into one contract, that would guarantee a higher conversion into the actual build.”

Yeah, maybe—but I might not want to build for these people after I go through the design work. By separating it, I have an easy out. I can just say, “No thanks,” and give them all of their information.

Dylan Martin: I’ve been paid—or, you know, they could have a life event, and something can happen. Maybe they don’t like us in the end. Maybe we just rubbed them the wrong way, screwed something up, and they want out. Cool. They’re not going to be a good client at that point—that’s just bad business.

So I’ve made it so that yes, if we do our job correctly and they love us through the design phase, they will go directly into a build. And it will be a good meeting, it will be a great build, and everybody will be involved.

That’s what I’m really shooting for—because taking a bad job, or the wrong client, or going into a project under the wrong pretenses—it never, ever goes well.

Dennis Oz: And it costs you money.

Dylan Martin: Oh yeah. Oh yeah, yeah. You can watch those profit margins evaporate. Been there, done that—not interested.

So if we get a bad feeling, we have an easy out. If they get a bad feeling, they have an easy out. But I would say 99% of the time, when we get through the design phase, we move into a construction project. I’ve only had a few people not do it—and that’s because I ignored the red flags early on. I probably shouldn’t have even gotten into design with them.

I was like, “Ooh, but I want this project.” I’ve got one, literally from a year and a half ago, very large project—had some red flags. We went through the design, got burned on being paid for it, and… yeah.

Dennis Oz: Got it. Well, that’s a very transparent answer to the question I asked. Thank you so much. I think our listeners and viewers are really getting the benefit. Thank you so much for sharing with such full transparency. This is great.

My next question is going to be all about this—maybe it’s more of a marketing question—because I’d like to ask you: since we have a long sales cycle, and sometimes people just show up and don’t decide overnight, how do you balance these long sales cycles while keeping your pipeline full and projects moving forward?

Dylan Martin: That is a very good question—and it’s something that we grapple with. Because even when we think we’ve got it figured out, the market shifts.

For example, two years ago, we were signing at a 100% rate. Everything we looked at—we were getting. And we had exponential growth. That was year two, which ended with a closeout cash flow of $2.3 million. And we had a million dollars’ worth of contracted revenue carrying into the following year. We were like, “Oh, we’re good. We’re on. This is great.”

We had money in the bank. Life was good.

So I got a little lax and thought this would be a fine business model. And that it would just continue.

And of course, I left the caveat—”as long as the market holds.” Well, the very next year… things got a little crazy.

Dylan Martin: And at the end of that year was when the Feds raised the interest rates. This is where I’m getting to your point.

I’ve never seen anything like it before—well, not since ’08. We had $10 million in our pipeline that we were discussing contracts on. Now, we didn’t have all $10 million signed, but I felt really confident about at least six of it.

They all held when the interest rates shot up.

Zero percent came out of that pipeline.

So, we started the next year with a $1 million carryover and no new contracts. And we were like, “Oh my God, what are we going to do?”

So, we hustled. At that moment, we started flexing—we pivoted into the outdoor space. We noticed a big movement toward outdoor kitchens, so we jumped on that. We sold two: one was about $230,000, and one we just finished that was about $500,000.

That helped.

We signed some other projects too, and we made it through last year—but just by the skin of our teeth.

To put the math into perspective:

The year before, we did $2.3 million—life was good. We paid out bonuses to everyone, had cash in the bank, and our infrastructure was right where I wanted it.

Then we entered the next year, where revenue dipped—we did $2 million.

Now, the difference between $2 million and $2.3 million?

• No bonuses
• No cash in the bank
• And we had to take out a payroll loan

I wasn’t going to let anybody go. I had my team in place. I love my people. I knew we were going to persevere and get through it. So I took out a pretty sizable loan to make sure I didn’t have to let anyone go.

We made it through the year and rolled into this one. Projects are ticking up, but it’s always a slow roll. Now we’ve got all these leads coming in—but back to your point about lead time, I’m getting to it the long way.

The point is—we found another niche market. We had never really done outdoor living before, and we jumped right into it. We’ve been very successful with it.

But again, we’ve currently got about $1 million in contracts we’re trying to get signed that are still in that long lead time. I think we’re going to sign one tomorrow, and hopefully another next week. Then we’ve got two more coming up behind that. So we’re like, “Okay—breathing room. Growth.”

But we also started to realize we needed something else. And I know a lot of good builders—bigger builders—and it’s good to know them. It’s a community. There’s enough work out there, and you can learn from each other.

So, I heard from another group that they had started doing small projects.

At first, I was like, Ugh. Small projects? I’m past small projects. I don’t want to do small projects.

Dylan Martin: And at the end of that year is when the Feds raised the interest rates. This is where I’m getting to your point.

With that shift, I’d never seen anything like it—well, not since ’08. We had $10 million in our pipeline that we were discussing contracts on. Now, we didn’t have all $10 million locked in, but I felt really confident about at least $6 million of it.

They all held when the interest rate shot up. Zero percent came out of that pipeline.

So we started the next year with a $1 million carryover and no new contracts. And we were like, “Oh my God, what are we going to do?”

So we hustled—and we did pivot. Right at that moment, we started flexing into the outdoor space. We noticed there was a big movement around outdoor kitchens, so we jumped on that.

We sold two projects:

• One was about $230,000

• The other, which we just finished, was about $500,000

We signed a few other projects too, and we made it through the year. But it was tough—skin of the teeth kind of year.

To put the numbers into perspective:

• The year before, we did $2.3 million. Life was good. We paid out bonuses, had cash in the bank, and our infrastructure was exactly where I wanted it.

• The next year, we dipped to $2 million. And that $300,000 difference? It meant no bonuses, no money in the bank, and I had to take out a payroll loan—because I wasn’t going to let anyone go.

I had my team in place. I love my people. I knew we were going to persevere and get through it. So I took out a pretty sizable loan to make sure I didn’t have to let anyone go.

We rolled into this year. Projects are ticking up—but it’s always a slow roll.

Now we’ve got all these leads and all this interest. But back to your point about lead time—here it is:

We found a niche market we hadn’t really explored before—outdoor living—and we jumped into it. We’ve been very successful with it.

Still, we’re currently sitting on about $1 million in contracts we’re trying to get signed that are in that long lead time. I think we’ll sign one tomorrow and hopefully another one next week. We’ve got two more coming up behind that. So we’re thinking, “Okay—breathing room, growth.”

But we started to realize we needed something else.

I know a lot of good builders—and it’s good to know them. It’s an industry where you can be friends. There’s enough work, and you can learn from others—especially bigger builders.

So I heard a rumor, and then confirmed it, that another group started doing small projects.

At first, I thought, Ugh. Small projects? I’m past that. I don’t want to do small projects.
And then there’s the ego—you’ve got to check that.

Luckily, I had just hired a new project manager. He had his own business, had a bad partnership, and it went under. We’ve known the guy for years. Solid dude.

He came to me and said, “I need a job.”

I told him, “I can’t hire you as a project manager yet, but I can hire you for your talent and pay you hourly.”

He said, “I’m in.”

So we brought him in.

Then he asked, “Why aren’t we doing small projects?”

I said, “Eh, I’m not interested in them.”

He said, “Well, we need the money.”

I replied, “Well… you’re not wrong.”

And that same week, I’d heard from that other builder who’s been successful with small jobs. I thought, Okay—John’s a smart guy. He brought this up. This is the second time I’m hearing it. Maybe God’s trying to tell me something.

So I said, “Alright John, tell me your thoughts.”

He told me, “We can’t do small projects with the same model we use for big ones. It costs too much. We’ve lost a lot of small projects because our layers of project management and support make the job too expensive.”

He’s right.

You’ve got to remember—on a national average, design costs run 7 to 12% of the total project cost. So if you call it 10% on a $100,000 job, that’s $10,000 just in design. That adds up quickly. On a $500,000 job, that’s a lot of design money.

We’re pretty efficient—we’ve averaged closer to 4 to 5% because we try to bring value to our clients.

Anyway, John brought this idea to me, so I sat down with him, my business partner (who does the estimating), our other project manager, and our office manager. I said, “Okay—how do we do this in a way that allows us to be profitable, but also lower our costs for these smaller projects?”

Because if someone just needs flooring, paint, some trim work—they don’t need all the bells and whistles. We can knock these out in two to three weeks.

So we sat down, brainstormed, and figured it out.

And now—we have a plan.

And we’re enacting it right now.

Dylan Martin: Like, we’re knee-deep in that planning. We put together spreadsheets, we did mock jobs, looked at past projects, and ran all the calculations. We broke it down to some very basic metrics: how many guys, how many days, estimated product costs, and what’s the bottom line we need to hit to say, “Okay, we can do this.”

Because if you can turn a $50,000 job in three weeks—I mean, that’s just flooring and paint these days, right?

You can turn that in three weeks and walk away with $20,000—that’s a win.

Now, it’s not the $150,000 or $200,000 you might make on the big jobs, but if you can do that consistently… Like, I can tell you right now, my average overhead—after slimming it down—is about $54,000 a month. We were running at $60–$65K, and with some things I’m bringing in, we’re going to bump into the high $70s.

Payroll averages about $10,000+ per week.

So if you know your numbers, you can plug those small jobs in and say, “Oh, if we do this consistently, it’ll start covering payroll.” Well, okay—that’s pretty cool.

One of my favorite analogies when I talk to smaller businesses I coach is this:

Most people understand cars and hot rods. If you’ve got a hot rod shop, you want to build those classic Mustangs or square bodies—and that’s awesome. But those are long builds. They’re expensive. And the cash flow is very slow.

So, what do you do? You’ve got to have the oil change station to keep the lights on—the maintenance jobs, the brake jobs. Those quick wins keep things moving.

That’s how we look at these small projects. They’re our oil change station.

We do the same quality of work. No one’s going to walk away saying, “Eh, this wasn’t great.” Quite the opposite. Some clients may not have the budget for our big jobs—but they have friends. You never know where the next big referral might come from.

So, to answer your question—we try to stack our jobs. And yes, when your pipeline is full, you don’t have to do small jobs. But markets shift. So it’s good to have a backup plan.

That’s why we opened our roofing division. It hails a lot in Texas—on average, there are 120 hailstorms a year. If we can do a roof a day, the take-home is anywhere between $7,000 and $15,000. Bigger roofs might take two days.

Now, roofing isn’t fun. It’s not glamorous. But it’s money. We do a really good job. We put effort into it. But it also helps us keep our coverage full.

So my point is—if you only focus on big jobs, you’re going to have long lead times. There’s no getting around it.

I’ve tried every way imaginable to speed up that process. But at the end of the day, you have a client—and that client is going to take however much time they want to:

• Answer questions

• Approve drawings

• Make decisions

You just can’t rush the client. And believe me—we’ve tried.

Here’s a rough timeline projection we use:

• After the first meeting, we schedule a ballpark estimate follow-up within two weeks max

• Then we try to close the design contract—which is on the client. It might happen on the spot, or it might take three to four months

• Once they’re in design, a fast turnaround is 2 to 3 months

• I’ve had some take a year

• The average is about 4 to 6 months

During that time, we go through:

• Drawings

• Interior design selections

• Scope additions (they always have epiphanies and add more)

• Final pricing with subcontractor meetings to lock everything down

That’s why those projects take so long.

So yeah—if you’ve got 15–20 of those rolling, you’re golden.

But inevitably, things slow down. The market shifts. Suddenly, your infrastructure is too big—like what happened to us. And then you’ve got to make a decision:

Do I have a way to fill the gap—or do I have to let people go?

Dylan Martin: If I let people go, I know the gap—we’re going to jump it, and then I’ll have to ramp back up. And then I’ll be stuck with so much work that I can’t manage it properly.

Or… I keep my people.

Or… I cut my people, and then I know I’ll have to rehire and train fast. So it’s a tough call.

But my people have flexed with us. And I’ve flexed for them. And we’re coming out of it—and we’re super excited about what this year is bringing us. This is amazing.

Dennis Oz: Yeah, exactly. This is amazing. Thank you so much for sharing those golden nuggets.

Dylan Martin: Absolutely.

Dennis Oz: Thanks so much. You mentioned that you separate design and build into two contracts—because sometimes, you don’t want to work with certain clients. That’s totally normal.

And most of our listeners and viewers know—not everyone is your ideal client. Like Dylan just said, sometimes you’ve got to let people go. Because, trust me, they don’t deserve your service.

Right, Dylan?

Dylan Martin: 100% correct. You’ve got to find people who understand your values and want your values. If they don’t—if they’re just looking for cheap, or trying to be sly, or trying to get something out of you—they’re not the right fit.

If you don’t go in with a professional mindset—like, “I’m your lawyer, I’m your doctor, I’m your therapist… well, I’m your builder”—then it’s not going to work. It’s the same genre.

And you don’t see those professionals going, “Oh, let me figure something out and cut you a special deal.” No—a lawyer has never done anything special for me other than represent me well. And yes, one time I needed it. Welcome to construction—if you haven’t been sued or sued someone, you’re just not growing. Fact of life.

That’s a whole other story.

But the point is: you have to go in with that mindset. We need our clients, we love them, we embrace them—but we have to find the right clients, the ones who truly value what we bring.

If you don’t go in with that professional attitude, they’ll smell it. You’ll sound desperate. And they’ll see how they can take advantage of you.

You’ve got to know who you are, be confident, and find people who respect that.

Dennis Oz: I just wanted to ask you—because this is something I really want to dig into—sometimes, with homeowners, you run into serious issues. Sometimes they want to sue you, right?

Dylan Martin: Oh, absolutely.

Dennis Oz: So just in general terms—not in super detail—but broadly:
What’s the best way to first avoid that situation?
And second, what should someone do if they receive a legal notice and are actually being sued?
Let’s talk about that a little bit.

Dylan Martin: Fair question. Since I opened Pandora’s Box—there you go. I don’t mind going through it because the very first piece of advice is:

Never do anything that you’d be afraid to have a light shined on.

If someone is going to look into your actions, you want to be able to say, “Absolutely—I did that, and here’s why.” If you live in that position, it doesn’t matter what they throw at you—it won’t stick.

The second piece of advice—and this will tie into the story I’m about to tell—is:

When you have a contract in place, follow it to the letter.

Don’t deviate. I don’t care how nice the client seems or how convenient it might be—follow the process exactly as it’s written.

So here’s the story:

Years ago—before Absolute Design Build—I had another company. It didn’t go well. I didn’t know how to hire correctly, didn’t know how to vet a partner, and it ended badly. I learned a lot—hence everything I shared earlier about hard lessons.

We landed our first really big project. On paper, it started at $230,000, and by the time we got through design—working with the client’s own designer and architect—it turned into about $425,000 to $450,000.

This was a massive whole-house renovation on a lake house—every room was touched. It was exciting. The client seemed great. He was fairly well known in Austin.

We ran it as a cost-plus project. And with cost-plus, you have to track everything—every receipt, every transaction. I’m a fan of cost-plus if you have clear rules and systems. But it requires diligence.

When we wrapped the job, we did a standard project audit, which is normal. Out of about $450,000, we found a discrepancy in his favor—a double-billed deposit related to some glasswork. We’d hired one glass company, had a problem, then switched to another. So two deposits had gone through. We immediately refunded $3,200.

That’s a solid audit result—$3,200 out of $450,000.

But he started picking apart everything. He called for another audit. Then a third. At that point I asked, “What is it you’re really after?”

Eventually, he admitted: “I spent more than I thought I would. I let you put the house on the home tour. It got written up in the American Statesman. You’re going to get a lot of work from this. I think you should give me a discount.”

He wanted 10% off.

Now, 10% of $450,000 is $45,000. That’s more than my total profit margin.

So I said no.

Three weeks later—I got served. He sued me.

I was shocked. I couldn’t figure out what grounds he had. He’d paid in full, I’d done all the work, we’d gone through multiple audits…

So I hired a lawyer.

It turned out—he was just trying to leverage me. He figured, “I’m a millionaire, this guy’s not. If I threaten him with a lawsuit, he’ll cave and give me the 10% discount.”

And the ammunition I gave him—and here’s the most important lesson—was this:

There was one point in the project where his designer wanted to make a small change—add a window above a door instead of a solid wall. Framers were on site, we were finishing the area that day. I called the homeowner, told him the change, said, “I can either stop everything and go the formal route—or I can just do it right now for $500. I’ll send you the paperwork after.”

He said yes—verbal approval.

My contract specifically stated:

No work shall be performed without a signed and written change order.

He used that moment—where I tried to be helpful—as the basis for his lawsuit. Even though the change was approved, documented later, and charged correctly.

Because it wasn’t signed before the work was done, he argued I had breached contract.

So the moral of the story is:

When you set guidelines—don’t deviate.
Even when someone seems nice. Especially when they seem nice.

This guy had shiny teeth, was charming, friendly—and he was a snake.
Clients are not your friends. Not during the project.

Your lawyer is not your friend. Your doctor, most of the time, is not your friend. Your builder? Same thing. You keep it professional.

Yes, we love our clients, we value them. But keep it business. You can be friends later—but not during the build. Because once you blur the lines, it’s much easier for someone to take advantage of you.

That moment—doing the change without the written signature—was one of my first big screw-ups.

We ended up getting out of it through some creative legal strategies. But I had to shut down that business, start over, and the legal bill on his end ended up being huge.

I came out of it not owing money—but I also had to start from scratch. It was a hard, expensive lesson.

Dylan Martin: So that’s the summary of that one. The takeaway?

Follow your own contract.
Even if it’s inconvenient, you follow it. If not, you’ll end up in a bad spot.

Dennis Oz: By the way, Dylan—do you still believe that being sued in our industry is inevitable? Like, are there only two types of people in construction: those who have been sued and those who will be? Is it really that common?

Dylan Martin: The best you can do is what we call risk mitigation.

You reduce risk by being:

• Transparent

• Delivering on what you say

• Following your contract

• Ensuring your subs share your values

• Having all your subcontractor agreements in place

Because if you open the door to be sued, chances are—you will be.

But if you do everything right and your due diligence is solid, your risk of being sued drops significantly.

That said, I’ve had a situation—I had one client, a really big job, lots of red flags. I ignored them. I wanted the project—sound familiar? I’ve made that mistake more than once. I’m a slow learner, but that’s why I’m sharing this—so you don’t have to learn the hard way like I did.

These clients were nice people. Wealthy. Wanted a very high-end project. But they fired the first designer. Then the second. Then they burned out the third. They didn’t like the building designer I brought in—Cammie Clear from Five Star Design in Austin, who’s amazing and I’ve worked with for decades. They didn’t like her either.

We finally got a design done. It should’ve been a nine-month project. It took three years—because they kept changing things, delaying decisions, and adding scope. I really tried to stick to our processes.

Then, the issue that brought it all to a head:
They had a $10,000 jacuzzi tub that started leaking.

They demanded I warranty it. I said, “I didn’t manufacture this. It says clearly in the contract: manufacturer’s warranty applies. You’ve been using it for a year.”

Their reply? “Well, you’re not done with the project.”

I said, “That’s not by my fault. Would you like to see the stack of emails, unsigned change orders, and all the delays from your end?”

I had job logs, documentation, and a long trail showing they had caused the delays.

At that point, I told them, “Honestly, you should just hire someone else to finish the project. That’s the most prudent move.”

So yes—people can and will threaten to sue you for anything. Especially if they have money. And money gives them leverage, power, and the ability to push you around if you’re not protected.

I went through three project managers on this job—they all burned out. I had to move them to other projects.

Do I think these people are bad?
No. I think they’re disconnected from the process. They have bigger priorities in life, and this project just isn’t getting their attention. But then they get upset—and boom: “I have an attorney.”

Well… so do I.

Let’s not waste our money. The project is almost done. This is silly.

But the big point is this:

Even when you do everything right, someone can still decide they’re mad.
If you ignored your instincts, you’re going to pay for it.

And I did.

It has cost us more than we’ve made on that project.

So again—follow your instincts. If it feels wrong, walk away. No matter how badly you need the job.

And yes—be prepared in advance:

• Have solid contracts

• Have subcontractor agreements

• Maintain great insurance

• Build a relationship with a good attorney

I’m not saying you need to be on retainer. I’m saying get to know someone before you need them. Go network. Join a BNI. Meet them for a beer or golf or whatever you do.

Because one day, when something goes sideways, you’ll want to be able to call someone and say, “Hey, bro. I need help.”

It’s good to have friends in the right places.

Dennis Oz: This is great. And just like you said—these aren’t always bad people. Sometimes it’s just circumstances. Life happens. The conversation turns into something complicated—and suddenly, you’re the one who needs to be protected. That’s why this show exists: to bring on people who’ve walked in your shoes.

This is super helpful. It’s full of real-world insights for people who are struggling with this stuff.

Thank you so much for sharing.

Let’s switch gears now and talk about marketing. Can you tell us about the number one service you really make money from? What are the top projects in your sales pipeline that generate the most revenue?

Dennis Oz: And we would like to learn how you either advertise or maybe do online and offline marketing. We just wanted to learn more about it.

Dylan Martin: Okay, well, our number one niche in our business is a whole house remodel with addition. That’s our number one thing. That is what we love to do. We take something, see the potential in it, and add the space required to make it work. We really thrive in that space.

Usually, once we get to the build, those are eight to nine-month builds. The margins are really good, and they keep us busy. If I could sell nothing but those all day long, that would be my focus.

I like ground-up builds too for various reasons. They’re easier once you start—it’s just go. A remodel is like a puzzle, while a new build is a blank slate. That said, new builds come with their own hassle—like dirt work and land prep—but once you’re into the structure, everything is straightforward.

They’re not as intriguing or fun, but we do them well and we put a lot of attention to detail into them.

And now that we’ve taken on more small projects, we’re doing a lot of things like “let’s just do this master bath, with flooring and paint throughout the house”—and that’s a $250,000 project.

We just did one for the mayor of Leander, by coincidence. She and her husband needed flooring downstairs, a kitchen island replaced due to water damage, new countertop, backsplash, and we painted the interior of the house. Not a big contract, but a good one—got it done in a few weeks, and they were really great people.

So, again—have your small jobs to keep everything full and your big jobs to anchor the business.

We’ve also done some really nice outdoor living projects. One we just finished isn’t on our website yet, but it will be—it’s in north Austin off the 620 area. Beautiful. It was an existing porch—we added the cover, a fireplace, outdoor living space—made some major changes. It was a half-million-dollar project. So definitely more than just a porch cover.

Another one we did in Georgetown included adding a slab roughly 16 by 35 feet, tying in a roof cover to the house, cutting open the back wall, installing a 16-foot multi-panel door that folds and stacks—full outdoor living setup with a fireplace and fans. Turned out beautiful.

The last really big project we did was in North Austin. It was a 1960s home, and my first recommendation was to bulldoze it. The clients said, “Oh, but it has good bones.” Ugh. Everyone says that. But it didn’t. It was missing a steel beam in the foundation from a poorly done garage conversion. Half the walls were rotten. By the time we were done demoing, all that remained was a portion of the slab and five stud walls. It would’ve been faster and cheaper to start over.

Still, it was a cool project—it’s on our website. We renovated the entire downstairs, moved the kitchen from the back of the house to the front, and discovered the slab problem while trenching for the new plumbing lines. We added a 750-square-foot addition on top of the house with a bathroom, common room, and two bedrooms. It turned out great.

Dennis Oz: Ideal projects. I think those are the ones you really love, right? That’s where you showcase your stellar service.

But Dylan—those are rare finds. How do you find those people? How do you attract those ideal clients?

Dylan Martin: We’ve been blessed with a lot of word of mouth.

You meet architects, you meet people—and nothing beats that.

When we started Absolute four years ago, I already knew a lot of people from my previous time in the industry. That was my cheat code. I called people, and they were like, “Oh my God, you’re back!” That helped.

Not everyone will have that head start—but what anyone can do is get out there and meet people. Wherever people gather—go. Don’t just take someone’s business card and wait. Follow up.

That’s what got us going.

For the past two years, we’ve been trying to get our digital footprint to perform—but it hasn’t. We’ve spent tens of thousands with agencies that didn’t work. Coming out of a rough year, I said I’d never do another trade show… but I changed my mind. Digital wasn’t working, so we tried something different.

We did a trade show—put a lot of planning and thought into the booth, didn’t spend too much. You can see photos on our Facebook page—we keep it active. The result? We booked 12 appointments at the show, and 18 total within a month after. We closed four contracts from it.

We then did a smaller home and garden show in a golf community—got good leads that are still in our pipeline.

So we decided to do another one. We’re doing a new trade show this May. We met with our marketing manager, planned everything on the whiteboard—booth design, materials, everything. You really have to plan.

For me, digital never worked. I’ve had empty promises and wasted a lot of money.

What always worked? Doing great work. Making people happy. Exceptional customer service. Meeting people. Following up.

I was just at a Chamber of Commerce mixer two nights ago. It was held at a bank in an affluent area—so I made myself go. I don’t love these things, but I go. Ran into people I hadn’t seen in four or five years. Got two appointments from it. Met people who needed my services. Met others who just wanted to know me. And that leads to “Hey, I know someone…”

Also—press matters. If you’re doing the right thing, sometimes the spotlight finds you.

There was a house explosion here in Austin a couple weeks ago. A friend of mine—a doctor—called and said his acquaintance lived next door. He gave her my number. She called me, I went out the next day to assess the damage. The house looked fine at first glance, but structurally it was toast.

While I was there, neighbors came over asking, “What do we do?” I told them: “Call your insurance. Call your attorney. Then call your builder. If you don’t have one, here’s my card.”

A news crew was there. They asked for an interview—I said sure. I gave advice: call your insurance, talk to a lawyer, then call a builder. If you don’t have one, I’m available.

We got a few calls from that. Maybe three contracts in the works now.

Then the newspaper showed up. They put us in an article—though they misidentified us as home inspectors, which we’re not. Still, the point is: we were there to help, not to promote ourselves. We served people. That’s what got the exposure.

So if there’s an event and you know the media will be there—go. But don’t make it about you. Just help.

Dennis Oz: Yes—thank you so much, Dylan. That was a great episode. I’m sure our listeners and viewers got a lot out of it.

If someone wants to reach out with questions—what’s the best way for them to contact you? Not your personal info, because this will be distributed to 15,000+ people.

Dylan Martin: Too late for that. I’ve used my personal cell for marketing since 2000. It’s never changed. I’m out there.

That said, if you share a number, please use the one listed on our website—that’s the number for new business.

If you call, I’d rather schedule a time so I can actually talk without rushing. I don’t like blowing anyone off—I’m just really busy.

Email works great. If you email me, I’ll either respond or set something up. I love helping people.

I did a podcast for JobTread, and a guy from Utah called afterward. He said, “This resonated with me—can we talk?” We had a follow-up call, I gave him everything—talked for an hour, emailed him resources. Never heard back. But I gave him everything we had. I’d gladly do that again.

Dennis Oz: World-class people share. That’s what we always say here, folks. And that’s exactly what Dylan did today.

Dylan, thank you so much for joining us and sharing all these golden nuggets and your hard-earned wisdom. This was an amazing episode.

And to our listeners—thank you for tuning in. I hope you’re getting as much out of these episodes as we are.

If you want to give back, just do what Dylan did: share what you’ve learned. Be transparent about your mistakes. Talk about your scars. Because that’s how we all grow.

We’ll keep bringing you this kind of quality content in future episodes.
See you next time!